1602: The Grave Detector part 1

Speaker: When I was a kid, I would take two wire clothes hangers, untwist them, straighten them out, and then bend them 90 degrees. I loosely held both steel wires in my hands and followed my grandfather's footsteps. He told me that this is how they used to search for water in Cuba before they dug a well. It's been years since I've used dowsing rods to locate water, so I went on Amazon and bought myself a really nice set of copper dowsing rods. The idea is simple. Simply hold the two L shaped wires parallel from each other, facing forward. If the wires cross, that means you are standing over your target. Legend has it that dowsing rod methods can not only help you detect water, some people believe it can help you find gold, silver, treasure, even objects from beyond this world. That's right, there's another term for dowsing rods. Some people call it divining rods, because its use allows you to tap into the spiritual world. Okay, a lot of people is not going to believe in this, but I am a believer and you need confidence in it too. Somehow, holding these two pieces of metal gives you the power of an oracle, where you could detect spirits in your presence, answer life's toughest questions. Is it best for me to buy this boat at this time in my life? Yes or no? Yes. Simply talking to these two pieces of metal taps into energy from another realm that's much smarter and wiser than the putts holding it. Dowsing rods or divining rods are also known as witching rods because back during the colonial times, those people who can magically find water or gold were thought to be witches. If you've listened to the show long enough, you know that I'm a skeptic. But I actually always believed that dowsing rods worked. I just kind of accepted it. At least for finding water. But after researching this ancient practice, I find some of its usage quite funny. Like the fact that people talk to these rods as if these metal wires speak English. To start dousing, you need to form an association with the rods. Now, to form an association with the rods is asking questions. It's probably not going to work if you're around a crowd of people, or you're in a noisy environment. You see, the rods are shy. The first question we ask is, what way would you go for the answer yes? And as you can see, my rods are crossing. Then the gentleman in the YouTube video asks the rods what they would do if the answer is no. And as you can see, you only need a little bit of movement, but no is opening up. So now I've worked out an association with my rods. Now that he's been properly introduced to his rods, it's time to get to work. Is there any buried silver in this field? There is buried silver in this field. Can you point me towards the nearest buried silver? See how both the rods are pointing in that direction? That's where we're going to walk. I've watched this six minute video. The guy walked right up to the buried silver, but apparently he didn't bring a shovel. What a letdown. But take his word for it, there's silver down there somewhere. People say dowsing rods can answer lots of things. Let's say you lost something very important. Perhaps your car keys, uh, in the living room, in the kitchen. That's right. Dowsing rods or divining rods can not only find your missing car keys, it can also help you find your missing loved ones. And that's what this new series is all about. Some people believe that dowsing rods and other pseudo scientific techniques can help find dead bodies and unmarked graves. I'm not kidding. Dowsing rods are being used by police departments, even today, to find human remains. And sometimes that evidence is allowed in court. I'm Javier Leyva and this is Pretend. Stories about real people pretending to be someone else. There will soon come a day that criminals will not be able to hide a human body. That's a quote from Dr. Arpad Voss, a renowned anthropologist who worked at the Oak Ridge National Laboratory. And he currently teaches at the National Forensic Academy in Oak Ridge, Tennessee. Dr. Voss studied under William Bass, who was the creator of the Body Farm, a two and a half acre wooded property where donated bodies are left to decompose. Scientists at the Body Farm are able to study different stages of human decay to better understand the time of death and the rate of decomposition. There are bodies laying on the ground, some are buried, others are locked inside of a car trunk, some are even submerged underwater. As gory as this all sounds, the Body Farm is a highly respected institution that's part of the University of Tennessee's Forensic Anthropology Center. It's a place where real scientists conduct serious studies, and a place to train law enforcement. Dr. Arpard Voss claims that because of his work and that of the University of Tennessee's Anthropology Center, scientists can now more accurately determine the time of death from weeks and months to around 12 hours. That's pretty significant. Especially when prosecuting a homicide case. Dr. Voss is also known for his role as a forensic expert at a blockbuster criminal trial. The Casey Anthony case, you know, the woman accused of murdering her two year old daughter. You see, Dr. Voss was developing an electronic detector that can one day replace the need for cadaver dogs. Imagine if this device can one day detect human decomposition simply by analyzing the odor in the air. He says that his research is being used by the FBI to create a database of the chemical compounds found in human decomposition. At the Casey Anthony trial, Dr. Voss claims that he tested air samples taken from a car trunk That witnesses say smelled like human decomposition. They actually had an air sample in a tightly sealed container as evidence at trial. We're going to talk more about the Casey Anthony trial later in this episode, but I'm telling you all of this because Dr. Arpad Bas is kind of a big deal. He even has his own TED talk. There's one inescapable fact about our lives, and that is that one day we will all die. I tend to think that, uh, we hope that this passing will be painless. In familiar surroundings and, uh, preferably in our sleep. But for thousands of people across the globe, especially those who've been murdered, that is not the case. And I've dedicated the last quarter century of my life trying to help those individuals to give them a voice so they can be heard. So, you may be asking yourself, body farms, the smell of death, Dr. Voss, what the heck does any of this have to do with dowsing rods? Well, everything. You see, while some people believe that you could locate water and silver with dowsing rods, Dr. Voss claims that you could find unmarked graves with it too. That's right. Dowsing rods are being used by police forensic departments to locate dead bodies. I reached out to Dr. Voss to see if he could explain to me how the same technology used to find water can also find people buried underground. I didn't hear back from him, but I did get an email from a colleague of his named Michael Hadsell. Michael told me that Dr. Voss had been, quote, screwed by podcasts in the past and asked if Hadsell could talk to me in his place. So, I gave Michael Hadsall a call. Hi Michael, it's Javier from the podcast. Oh, hey, how are you doing? Michael Hadsall runs a non profit called Peace River Canine Search and Rescue. Their mission is to find the missing, whether it's in a natural disaster or a potential crime scene. Michael Hadsall's team of volunteers and dogs are always on the search. We have tracking dogs, we have horses, we have drones, and we've got canines, tracking dogs, and area search dogs, and we also maintain cadaver dogs. Like I said, Michael Hadsall works with Dr. Baas, so I asked him what he thinks about using dowsing rods to locate unmarked graves. I have them right here. Here they are. Had soul pulls out two metal rods. I have them right here. So I keep them right. Yeah. So you have your own set of doubts. Oh, I've got several sets. Yeah. So how do you explain this without sounding like a complete moral? It's really simple. I mean, this is about. Electromagnetism. That's all it is. Bones have a property, which is called piezoelectricity. You can look it up on Wikipedia. It's there. And basically, when a bone is open and it's under pressure, it generates an electric field. And with an electric field, it generates magnetism with magnetism and also generates a resonance frequency. And that's all we're doing, is trying to find it with electromagnetism. That's all this is. Whoa, there's a lot of science terms flying at us right now, so let's break it down. He mentioned piezoelectricity. Piezoelectricity is a real thing. It's a phenomenon where applying force to certain materials actually produces electricity flow. Think about an electric guitar. A guitar's pickup has piezo crystals, which converts the vibrations into voltage. And that's what makes a sound. Michael Hadsell is right. Bones also have crystals in them in the form of calcium. And in theory, if a bone is under pressure, let's say buried six feet under, that enormous pressure could maybe produce enough electric energy for a receiver to pick it up. So, it's plausible, but I'm still skeptical. Hadsoe explains that it sounds like magic, but in reality, it's much simpler. This is steel. Steel is reactive to electromagnets. So that's, it's magnet, you know, it reacts to magnetism and that's what we use it for. That's all it is. It's not some kind of big hooky pooky witching sticks. You know, we're not doing seances at night, trying to get these things to work or anything like that. We don't do that. This is just strictly electromagnetism. That's all it is. You are perfectly comfortable using the dowsing rods to zero in on the grave shaft is what you're saying. Yep. So it's more of a precision tool in your opinion. Right. It's getting us closer and even then sometimes it doesn't because the body has spread out or parts of it is spread out. You'll find these things will get you around it, but maybe not right to it. Because they're that sensitive that they do that and usually the way we know it is when we get on top of it, this piece here will start spinning in a 360 like that. When you're on top of the body, it'll just start spinning because it doesn't know which way to point So it's just trying to point at everything You have bones, I mean i'm not trying to be ignorant, but you have bones Why isn't it pointing at you because it's covered with flesh? Once the flesh goes away the bone's exposed and the bone is it once the bone's exposed Then that's when the piezoelectric resonance frequency takes effect Do you use it all the time? Like every time you're I used it yesterday and found three historical cemeteries yesterday So it works like a charm, like, are there times when it doesn't work? There's times, you know, it's going to point to anything that's giving off a magnetic. And so, is it 100 percent reliable? No. But nothing in this world is 100 percent reliable. Cadaver dogs are not 100 percent reliable. Ground penetrating radar is not 100 percent reliable. You know, photo imagery is not 100 percent reliable. In other words, Hadsall tells me that dowsing rods are just another tool in their arsenal. But I'm not convinced. After the break, we are going to hear from a seasoned homicide investigator who actually took Dr. Vassa's one week course at the National Forensic Academy. Let's see what he has to say about dowsing rods. Did you try the dowsing? Did you see how it works? Yeah, yeah, look. There were bones laid out on the ground. We passed by the bones, the dowsing claws, meaning there's indication of a bone in the area. This is retired homicide investigator Freddy Ponce. When I say laboratory sense, that means that you know where an item is, and then you test to see if it works. And did it work? And it worked. You know, we were all there, we witnessed it, where several of the students got up and tried it themselves. Rocked by the bones and the dowsings, the dots, they crossed. So we're like, hey, wow, this is interesting. It's something to look at. It's something, an additional tool. Freddy Ponce has 25 years experience working for the City of Miami Police Department, and 15 of those years was as a homicide investigator. Miami is not exactly Mayberry, and Freddy Ponce tells me he's no Barney Fife. You've been around for a long time. Miami's not a sleepy town, right? So you, you definitely seen your fair share of homicides and you're, you're a serious professional and the National Forensic Academy is a serious place for professionals, right? It's divided into ten weeks and he was there during anthropology week when we were at the body farm. Oh, I see. We were there over a week. Other stations had bodies that were outside There was an entomology station, there were bodies above the ground, there were bodies hanging, there's bodies everywhere, it was a lot of work. But he didn't strike you as somebody like selling, you know, quackery? Uh, everybody respected him, they brought him from the NFA, brought him over, so he was there for, for a week. And you don't know Dr. Voss personally, other than from this training? That's correct. I don't know him outside at the NSA now. And have you ever in your entire career used that technique of dowsing? No, I have not. I have not. I've never, I've never used it. Freddy Ponce is retired now, but I asked him if he would ever use dowsing in a real life investigation. And he said he wasn't sure, but he wouldn't be opposed to it if it actually helped. Is this dowsing thing going to work in real case? Maybe it has worked in one or two cases. If. Somebody had used it in the past, and it worked, and somebody says, Look, I got nothing else on this case. Somebody's got some dowsing rods, and he knows how to use them. Uh, let's see if it works. And they find the body. Why not use it as a tool? Maybe he gives families false hope. I know there was a family that was searching for a body, and, and he came up short. You know, like it didn't work. But you could understand why somebody would think that this, his techniques are a little weird or untraditional, right? I don't know that I would understand why anybody would think that. I wonder, you know, if it's kind of like you're subconsciously moving the rods. No, no, no. And if you just say, Hey, look, only Dr. Vass had the rods in his hands and that he was the only one using it to walk by the bone. And it wasn't the case. He, he showed, you know, what you need to do. You walk towards the bone. He showed, Hey, there's a bone over there at a distance, walk towards it and keep walking. And they crossed when, when, when he walked by it and then he goes, now you guys try it. And different people tried it and it worked. So it wasn't something, you know, if you question it that way. If he would have said, listen, you guys are not touching the rocks. Only I can touch it. Then, then, you know, we thought, Hey, look, you're full of shit. Why don't you leave the classroom? That's bullshit. We want to try it. And they did. And that's how. You know, with anything in science, you first come up with an idea, you put it to a test and you test and you test and retest and you reconstruct, and then you have peers to test what you believe is a theory and to see if it becomes a fact. And that's what we, that's what we do in science. He's right. That's what we do in science. And luckily for us, a group of German scientists slash skeptics put dowsing rods to the test. Not to locate bodies because no independent study has ever tested Dr. Vassa's claims. These scientists, with this non profit group called GWUP, which is a German acronym that translates to the Society for the Scientific Examination of Parasciences. These guys were simply trying to figure out if dowsing rods could find water. Experienced dowsers were told that they could win 10, 000 if they could locate water running through a series of pipes underneath the building. The 19 participants were not told whether the water was actually flowing through the pipes. This ensured that the dowser's ability to locate water or substances could not be influenced by any prior knowledge. So what did they find? Well, the results showed that these so called professional dowsers had as good of a chance of finding water as flipping a coin. Yeah, no one was awarded the prize. Is this study implying that these 19 participants were We're a bunch of trick betrugers? That's con artists in German, by the way. Probably not. I don't think these guys were trying to pull a fast one on anyone. I think some of these people really believe it works. In this video, a man holding two dowsing rods is trying to prove that he's not making the rods move. He takes a step forward, and the rods cross. Anybody saying that I tipped them, I can prove them wrong. And you can clearly see the rods hit me and bounce. I don't, and I'm holding a tube now, and I don't twist my hands. He walks forward one more time, and the wires crossed again. I didn't do that. I will come from this direction. Clearly see. I This man may not realize it, but even the slightest movements, which are not always visible to the naked eye, can subconsciously make the rod swing in whichever direction he wants to go. It's called the ideomotor phenomenon. Scientists from Tel Aviv University studied this effect and found that using a motion capture system, participants holding a pendulum on a string over a piece of paper with the words yes or no, didn't make the pendulum swing a particular direction. In fact, very small movements of the arm is enough to produce a relatively large pendulum motion. It doesn't matter how still you hold your hands, according to this study, your mind is playing tricks on you. I'd like to introduce you to Chris Fabricant. And if you've ever used a Ouija board, you know, everybody swears they're not touching it. And it feels really legit, right? That it's kind of moving on its own, you know, and this whole thing. Chris Fabricant is the Director of Strategic Litigation at the Innocence Project and author of the book, Junk Science and the American Criminal Justice System. There's no, there's obviously no science to a dousing rod that's, that's hogwash. It's incredible that it's used in any case where life or liberty is at issue. I mean, all junk science sounds plausible to some extent, right? That's the beauty of junk science. You know, I mean, is that, you know, it can say whatever you need it to say. It sounds superficially plausible, particularly if it's being introduced by somebody that you need to call a doctor and is in a white lab coat and is using a lot of scientific terminology. So let's get back to Dr. R pod boss. Dr. Voss, for 10 years, worked at the Oak Ridge National Laboratory as a senior research scientist leading a group of biochemical engineers. And for those of you who don't know, the Oak Ridge National Laboratory is famous for its pivotal role in the Manhattan Project during World War II. And today, It's still one of the largest and most prestigious research facilities in the United States. But Dr. Voss no longer works at Oak Ridge National Laboratory. In fact, he got fired. We're going to talk about that after the break. So if dowsing can't reliably find water, can it really find bones? Long before Dr. Arpard Voss started teaching dowsing at the National Forensic Academy, he was working on different ways to find human remains. Like we discussed earlier, Dr. Voss tried to harness the smelling power of cadaver dogs. Because cadaver dogs don't always get it right. I'll have Dr. Voss explain. Because the dogs can't talk to you, they can't tell you what chemicals they are smelling. So we did an eight year study looking at, as we decompose, what chemicals are liberating Soft tissue and skeletal material decomposition. This is audio from Dr. Arpad Voss TEDx talk back in 2012. And we pared it down to 30 chemicals, which we considered most important in human decomposition. I think the results will surprise you. So now what's our next step? Our next step is to develop our own Labrador. Yes, Dr. Voss invented a device called the Labrador, that can turn odors derived from chemicals found in human decomposition and convert those into sounds. So without further ado, I give you the sound of death in the key of C. And now a pig. The 12 sensors in there, um, and each one is, is modulated at different frequency. To date, these chemical signatures have led to the discovery of over 100 clandestine graves. How cool is that, see? The death, the death can talk to you. And they can be heard. The Labrador device never made it into production, but the fact that Dr. Voss claims that he can narrow down the chemicals left behind from human decomposition is a game changer, at least in the criminal justice system. Remember earlier I told you that Dr. Voss was a forensic expert at the Casey Anthony trial? Not just an expert, but one of the prosecution's key witness. Casey Anthony was charged with first degree murder in the 2008 death of her two year old daughter, Kaylee Marie. A jury ultimately found Casey Anthony not guilty of first degree murder, aggravated manslaughter of a child, and aggravated child abuse. But they did find her guilty on providing false information to police. You see, according to witnesses, including Casey Anthony's own mom, the trunk of her car split. Melt like death. Dr. Voss tested carpet samples taken from Anthony's car. Some say that Dr. VA's testimony may have contributed to Casey Anthony's acquittal, and here's why. I'm gonna play you a string of audio clips of Dr. VA's testimony on the stand. These are different clips of sound bites and no particular order. We'll start with the prosecutor, Jeff Ashton, when you opened the can which contained the carpet sample submitted to you. What was your reaction? Well, first I jumped back about two feet. Uh, 'cause the odor was pretty strong. Uh, but it, it, it was to me the smell of human decomposition. This is there a specific established chemical odor signature for human decomposition. A clear and specific one to human decomposition only. I do not think so. The defense attorney, Jose Baez, wasn't buying it. The smell of human decomposition is unique. To me it is, yes. Do you recall making a statement, sir, to the Knoxville News on December 14th, 2008, that the smell of human decomposition is unique? Smells like a potato gone bad that it is sickly sweet. It doesn't smell like a swamp or a rotten egg smell. If you ever had a potato go bad in your cupboard, that's a horrendous smell. That's very similar to human decomposition. It's amazingly similar. I believe I made that statement. Yes. Human decomposition is very unique. Just like a skunk. I mean, if you, if you ever smelled a skunk, You don't need to see that a skunk had been run over to know that it had been. Is it generally accepted science, sir, to collect control samples of a free air flowing environment six weeks later? I have no problem with it. That's not my question. I asked you, is it generally accepted science? Depends on the circumstances, and since I was one in the analysis, I make that determination. Here's the prosecutor, Jeff Astin, talking to BBS Frontline after the trial. There was a stained area in the carpet that appeared to be possibly the source of the odor. So, that piece of carpet was sent in a sealed condition to Oak Ridge National Laboratory for Dr. Voss to look at. Dr. Voss has been studying the odor of decomposition for a decade, attempting to isolate those compounds, That are unique to human decomposition and you don't know the history of the car in florida. Now, you've never done studies On what's in carpet? No have not in fact, you have absolutely no experience as to what the chemical breakdown is of carpet Correct. Okay. I'm not a chemist. Yeah. Yeah Junk junkyards. Yes. I did not collect those. No, you were told that these were with the trunk open Oh unlocked and I believe And again, you are not a chemist, so these are things that are a little bit outside of your area. Okay. Is that a yes? Yes. The defense brought in their own expert witness. Do you have an opinion, after looking at the five chemical compounds that Dr. Voss found in this case, as to whether those Chemical compounds are the makeup of human decomposition. Uh, yes, they do. It's my opinion that using, that those five compounds are not unique to human decomposition because two of the compounds are found in household products such as, uh, bleach. They could have been a bag of trash in the car, groceries. With pork or beef in it and maybe some cheese. At first blush, it seems that the state was trying to prove that a dead body was in the car, but instead all they were doing was pointing out that the chemicals were consistent with human decay. The point is, there is no peer reviewed literature that suggests that human decay actually has a chemical signature. The defense attorney asked Dr. Voss during the cross examination about the Labrador. You know, the device he invented that picks up odors of human decomposition? Here's the defense cross examination. You are not a chemist. Correct. You're not an analytical chemist. You're not a biochemist. Correct. And therefore you really can't testify as to the chemistry and the makeup of things of which you have no experience, correct? This is the point in the trial where the questions drifted away from the Casey Anthony case And focused on Dr. Vassa's previous experiments. Part of what you are doing currently is you hold a patent for a device called the Labrador. Incorrect. Okay. You are an inventor of this Labrador? I am listed as an inventor on a patent disclosure, yes. And what your goal is with this Labrador? To sell these units they are handheld devices that look like a metal detector almost correct and these Devices the goal is to sell these to police departments all across the country in my position at the National Lab We are required to To file invention disclosures. The end product of that was an instrument used to aid and augment cadaver dogs to locate clandestine graves. Did you understand my question, sir? I'm getting to that. I have no say whatsoever. If the laboratory decides to file a patent or not, it's not my decision. Did you understand my question, sir? I think I answered your question. I don't think you did. The goal of this The goal of this, sir, is to sell this to police departments all across the country. No, my goal is not to sell these at all, my goal is to develop them so that an investor, if the patent ever gets awarded, could come in and license that patent and they could build things, but the goal of the project was to create a technological tool that law enforcement can use to aid in locating clandestine graves. Then the topic of dowsing came up. I'd like to talk to you about another topic, sir. Can you tell the ladies and gentlemen of the jury what divining rods are? Yes. Divining rods are antennae used to locate specific properties of specific materials. And can a divining rod be made of a coat hanger from a dry cleaner? Sure. As long as it's the right material, yes. And have you taught on this subject to use coat hangers to find hidden graves? Absolutely. It's a, it's a, it's a hobby of mine, just like stamp collecting, coin collecting, and it teaches wonderful scientific principles. After this rocky testimony, Arpard Voss was let go from the Oak Ridge National Laboratory. Now, Oak Ridge National Laboratory won't say whether their decision had anything to do with the Casey Anthony testimony, but the timing was suspect. Here's ARPOD VASA's colleague Michael Hadsall again. You're asked about what happened, where things happened, went wrong for him, and that was Casey Anthony, the Casey Anthony case. He did, some people don't belong on the witness stand. I mean, he is not a good Testifier, you know, when you get him. He's an academic, right? And, and he has a little bit of a speech problem. And, and so he, he comes off as kind of odd, you know, at times when he talks. Now, the thing about the Casey Anthony case is that everything that he said was absolutely right. And in the long run, it was proven to be correct. The bad part was, is that the state attorney's office. Should have jumped up and, you know, defended him at times when the, when the other lawyer was, was setting them up. And cause Arpad's not skilled in, in where this attorney was going with this thing. And I remember watching it at home. I'm thinking to myself, Oh, watch out, you know, cancel culture. I think he was probably one of the first victims of cancel culture that I ever saw. People just started torpedoing him left and right. And of course, Arpad didn't come out defending himself and he should have, you know, but he won't. It affected the fundraising. Okay, so universities work on fundraising too, and you have to bring money in to help, you know, grants and all this other stuff. Well, it affected him in that capacity, and he was ended up being let go. But Arpad Vassa's career is nowhere near over. He has a few more inventions up his sleeve, and this next gizmo could be one of the most significant inventions ever created. If this thing actually works, it's right up there with artificial intelligence, self driving cars, or mapping the human genome. So here's the pitch. Dr. Voss claims that he can find your great great grandfather's grave using DNA found in your fingernail clippings with, get this, 92 percent accuracy. He calls this invention the Quantum Oscillator. We're going to talk about this invention in part two. I also got a hold of Dr. Voss and asked him a bunch of questions. That's next time on Pretend.